Building EV charging infrastructure that lasts with Louis Tremblay from FLO

Converting from gas powerered cars to Electric is a key component to fighting Climate change but for many drivers the Lack of charging infrastructure is a Major barrier to entry but that's Starting to change as of May 2023 the US Had installed just shy of 140,000 Charging stations many of which are in Urban centers so how does a company Tackle creating an infrastructure for People everywhere to charge up their EVS you're listening to found Tech Crunches podcast that brings you the Stories behind the startups from the f That are building them today we're Talking with Lou trbl the CEO and Founder of Flo which is a company that Manufactures EV charging stations for Public charging spots and to be Installed in homes I'm Becca scoutek and Here with me is my electrifying co-host Dominic madori Davis and of course Before we get into our conversation we Have our two troops in a lie so listen Carefully to see which one of these Statements is not true is it that Working with both the US and Canadian Governments was easier than expected That Lou knew he was going to be founder By the time he was eight or that Flo Launched an at home supercharger that Can give cars 80% of battery power in 15 Minutes and before we dive fully into The conversation if you wouldn't mind

Taking a second to just rate and review The show on whatever platform you are Already listening to this episode on we Would greatly appreciate it we won't Delay any further but here is our Conversation with Louie hey Lou how's it going pretty good Back pleased to meet you pleased to meet You Dominic as well pleased to meet you And I will say are you based in Quebec I'm based in Quebec City yeah H so I am Unfortunately legally obligated to ask You that not really anyone who actually Knows anything about legal contracts but Um are you a Canadians fan I'm a Canadians fan but I I have to say I used To be a Nordic fan oh yes back in the Days so I'm not as passionate about Hy As I was no I'm a Bruins fan so we Probably shouldn't talk about hockey too Much anyway yeah that's not a good Subject for us so why don't we dive into What we are here to talk about why don't You tell us a little bit about Flo sure Flo was born in 2009 as an entrepreneur I was I in the EV since 2004 and the Mission of flow is really to accelerate The EV adoption providing the best Charging experience whether it's at home At work on the go so we provide 100% of The need of a needy drivers and we want To bring a comprehensive experience so Whether it's great product great Interface the mobile app the integration

With OEM with utilities so the goal is Really to provide a an easy access to Charging for you know EV drivers to Enjoy their EV car and I'll give you a a Little bit of numbers we have more than 100,000 Chargers deploy in North America We are a the dominant player in Canada But definitely growing into the states This is where we expecting to grow the More in the next coming years we are Excited because today we're launching Our new X Series own products so it's Three product providing the needs of 100% of consumer we've launched over the Last year but we're started to produce Today we had the first unit produced in Michigan of our Ultra charger so Something that can charge 80% of your Battery pack in 15 15 minutes so really Excited about that uh product that was Three years in in a making but yes it's Where Flo is right now and I'm so Interested about this company because we Talk about EVS now all the time and more And more people are buying them and and The infrastructure especially around Chargers have become such a bigger part Of like General infrastructure Conversations I know we're talking about It a lot here in New York City like Having the city install Chargers that Anyone can use Etc but you guys started This company back in 2009 when EVS were Not as big of a part of the conversation

And I'm curious how did you get Interested in this space to begin with Yeah that's a long story but I just want To use you you talk about New York it Was one of our first customer in the us And we're really proud because when I Was talking about experience one thing We've been doing as you mentioned for a Long time 15 years is that a great Charging experience start with a Reliable charging experience and in New York with the curbside charger we've Deployed in every of the five b rows Last year they made a study you know They get their own data you know usually We have our own data but 99% of the Station were working all the time what I Mean by that in our industry we monitor Reliability with uptime so 99% up time And why I'm talking to you about this is It really demonstrate who flow is for The last 15 years we've not installed Dots on the map as many have but we have Deploy a reliable Network a network that You can always depend on and that's what I'm the most proud of so back to your Questions I fell in love in 1997 On climate change I wanted to turn that Into a business I always have been an Entrepreneur in 2003 when I started my Undergrad I really didn't like it was Electrical engineering to techy not Enough practice so I decided to found a Project in 2004 20 years ago to build an

Electric car I fall in love with Eves I Started to see how can I bring more EES On the road people were talking about The range comparing EVS at golf cart and There were not that many EVS around the Road at that time and I strongly believe That EVS would disrupt the internal Combustion engine cars because of Lithium ion battery it was easy to Calculate the potential autonomy the Potential efficiency there so I decided To be the answer of that question where People's going to charge and brain Charging in a simple fluid way in a flow Way at home at work and on the go and it Really snowball when we started Officially the company in 2009 and and Started to really deliver on our promise To bring reliable Chargers to to any new EV Commerce where there were not that Many at the time but uh definitely it Has snowballed in the last 15 years That's so interesting because we so Often talk to not even just Founders but You see it in government policy you see It in a lot of areas where it's like Okay everyone's doing this thing now and Like oh whoops we never built the Infrastructure for it which is exactly Why New York is now like oh crap people Are buying EVs and like we should have Thought about this 5 years ago so it's Really interesting to hear that you guys Kind of like entered the space early

Knowing that if and when ev's got Adoption they were obviously going to Need a way to charge yeah totally Becca And one thing that I want to stress is We've deploy hundreds if not billions of Dollars since 15 years the problem with A lot of infrastructure that have been Deploy is they don't last they don't Work so this is why flow is so different Like we have product that have been Installed for 15 years still working Still being updated with software and Still meeting our 98% promise of up time My point is it's not only about how we Going to pour public and private money To build infrastructure but making sure We have standards like the federal Standard for the Navy deployment program In the states it's required 97% of time We didn't have that performance standard Before it's something we we push a lot In the industry because the worst thing We have to fulfill our mission is that People Embark into the EV Journey and The first trip they make when they get In front of a charger it doesn't work For any reasons and that's the promise We've been fulfilling for the last 15 Years and speaking of the Chargers since You got into this like a long time ago How is the process of sourcing a lot of The hardware to create these charging Stations evolved as I assume the Industry has progressed these past

Decades I'll start by saying to really Understand who flow is is we are a Charging Network operator this means That we need a charger right so we have Developed back to your question we have Developed a manufacturing part so we Develop our own product the new oh Series we're bringing to market the tree Product the ultra Chargers but we've Been developing standard charging that Charge you overnight or Ultra fast Charging the point we've have that Manufacturing Hardware division or role We're playing we have software where People don't understand how much Software is but we're around 600 Employees at flow we have 150 in the Product the development only not Manufacturing only the product and 75% Is software and all the software is the Connection with the vehicle the mobile App managing the members managing the Energy is really important if you want To bring a great experience so Hardware Is important because it's the Infrastructure that lasts software is to Make a great experience and on the other Side you use the hardware and software To operate a great Network to answer Sur Phone to look at your alarming system That tell you oh this station need Maintenance if not it's going to be a Hoptime killer so we have all those Vertical but back to your question about

Sourcing we have a manufacturing plants In Canada we have one in Hubb Hills Michigan and we have a great source of Partners to be able to deliver tens of Thousands of chargers every year I would Say we're shipping right now around 5 to 8,000 charger every month so you have to Make sure you can Source the component Obviously through covid to the supply Chain it's been a challenge but with our New generation coming with the latest And greatest we have secure our supply Chain we have all the the new micro Processor that are Leading Edge that are Growing in the foundaries and everything But it's been a challenge but it's Really important to understand usow We're not only a software company we're Not only a network we're doing those Three Sports which is you know man Facturing developing software and Operating a network called its service a Network with a similar vein with the Company starting before a lot of people Were interested in the space the same Way they are now what has it been like Fundraising so I know you guys have Raised a substantial amount of venture Funding but I'm sure it wasn't as easy Of a sale back when people weren't as Interested in this space so what has it Been like fundraising for flow and how Has it changed in the different rounds You guys have done that's a great

Question because when you start a Business you know you're going to have To fund raise but you don't know how Much you're going to need to fund raise It's up and down I would say there's Years that it's easier for sure like two Years ago two years and a half the Returning of covid was easier it's Harder right now but we're fortunate We're backed by a great investor that Support our our mission and believe in What we've accomplished for the last 15 Years but definitely when when we Started it's a challenge because what's Your Market Louie there were no Market Back in 2009 so it's being created so You you make your way in with some love Money your own money some government Grants for R&D for instance or doe Grants that you know you can use to to Do some prototyping or some Commercialization help so it was really A tough Journey until I would say where We really started to raise Equity money With our first big series a in 2016 so Seven years after our foundation which Which pretty big and now we're raising Our Series E right now so it's been a Great journey and I would say one thing That I learn comparing myself to other Player is we're really cash efficient as A French Canadian big proud there we do More with less and I also wanted to ask About the concept here because Eevee is

One of those interesting Industries Where some people get tax credits for Owning an EV or there are different Regulations around cars but as well as I'm assuming around charging as well and Knowing that you guys manufacture and Operate in both the US and Canada we Just recently had a company on that Tried to bring logs over the Canadian Border and they got stopped and it was This whole ordeal because of the Different border laws and Agriculture And stuff which obviously this is very Different but I am curious because you Do operate sort of on both sides of the Border in manufacturing and on the Actual customer facing side is there Anything there that's like you guys have To keep your eye on or like oh when we Do this in Canada we have to do it this Way we do the we have to do it this way Like how is it managing that kind of Stuff oh my God this is a big thing when You start a business I'm telling you you Don't I didn't know how much regulation Public Affair we needed to do but it's Key you believe it's key like our Industry won't happen overnight it's Been 15 years and it will be another 15 If not 30 years the point is we are Fighting climate change we are Transitioning the way we power our Transports we're doing the energy Transition so it's big

Revolution and you know there's a pain Right the climate change the ghg there's A pain but we have to make sure that Every stakeholder every stakeholder Private the governments utilities OEM We're making that transition and and There's business there's there's jobs During that transition so it's something That I learned and it's really important For our business is really to work with Everyone to be really collaborative Because at some point we need a price For the carbon at some point if the car Are too expensive they will be cheaper Like the bill of material if you look at A car a toy you add when you are young It's really easy to manufacture compared To internal combustion engine car but You have to have a volume a certain Volume to amortized as investment so This is why our industry need to support The government that I have ghg Target That I have longer Mission driven Target To help the world to succeed so this is Why we need to monitor work in Collaboration but every States even Though you have some federal requirement Every stat has different like California Is so different than than others you Want to make sure you're in California You want to make sure you understand Influence the rules because it's going To pour in every States after it's going To pour at the federal level so yes it's

Definitely something that I learned and Something that you know governments have Been great partners and oems and the Utilities we all have a different agenda On our side we live and die with EVS so If we're not able to deploy Infrastructure that are being used or de Right others has more implication and Depending of which candidate and we Won't make policy here today but which Candidate in Canada and states and at The federal level you know it's really Evolved but at the end of the day we Need to make that transition over 30 Years so definitely a big Hot Topic but I cannot Hammer that more and more I Need to work with all those stakeholder With our competitors to make that Transition happening over time and the Idea of Regulation made me think about The EU forcing Apple to make one charger For all of their devices and so I Started thinking when you're creating or When you have like an EV charger how Does that work when I guess not all EV Charging ports are the same like I'm Assuming different cars have different EV Chargers and so how do you kind of Create one charger that works for all These different cars back in the days we We decided what was the standard in 2007 But since then they were two main Chargers they were the what I call the Apple charger the Tesla charger

Connector it's just the connector and I Would say the industry standard what We've seen in last year and I'm glad That it happened after all is most OEM Most large and small OEM have decided to Move car manufacturer have decided to Move to the Tesla standards so the G3400 standard so now we're seeing that The two standard that used to coexist But only Tesla for Tesla charger and our Universal charger used to charge Tesla And every car in the market now with our Product the product we're launching Today our own product we have the Tesla Charger or the G1 1772 which used to be The standards but I'm expecting in the Next three year it will merge we will Convert many Chargers and at the end We'll have only one cord but everything And behind mostly everything behind is Compatible with every car are the two Chargers is that something like the Industry just agreed on or did the Government swoop in and say no you guys Need to do a standard charger on that Side regulator standard buy I decided on Universal and for years it was both but The industry decided last year the OEM Decided to embrace the Tesla connector Which now will be only hopefully in Three years only one card but to any Chargers you'll be able to access in the Coming uh three years for instance You'll have an adapter I I have a Tesla

And I have a pickup for lightning so When I I plug into my own flow Network I Don't use an adapter when I plug into Tesla I use an adapter when I'm driving My Tesla and I use the flow I have an Adapter but when I plug to Tesla I don't Have an adapter and this will merge as The industry is converging in the next Three years which is a great news for Everyone because any charger in the Market will be a charger when everyone Can charge and what is it like for you Guys if you do have to kind of make the Changes or make the adaptions to the Existing charging stations as you have As a company is that like a really big Undertaking or is it not as daunting as I'm making it up to be in my mind It's not a big deal for us I cannot Speak for others because we're Vertically integrated so we control our Own Hardware our own software we have a Services team and we have service Partner for you know all the states all The provinces of Canada so we're able to Make that transition there's a couple of Hoops you need the stand the connector To be standardized so you can use it but Beside that it's pretty simple for the Player we are because we control every Aspect of our Network and that's a you Brought up having the Tesla and the Ford Lightning cuz I was definitely going to Ask you about what kind of e you drove

Cuz I assumed you did drive one so it is Fun to hear that you do drive a Tesla And a Ford Lightning cuz I know here in The US at least the Ford Lightning was Like the big launch in eveve land like I Feel like people who weren't interested In this maze like got interested because Of the Ford Lightning so it is Interesting to hear that you do drive Both because they're both very I mean They're approaching the market very Differently yeah I'm kind of Tech guy I Would say so I love to test the product For sure and I like to compare the Tesla One you know compared to I would say a Big the big tree like Ford I love my Pickup I'm a Hunter I'm a Fisher I have Three kids it's awesome you go Everywhere it's really rubust it's Reliable as the flow Network so it's Perfect and I know like the silado just Came out bigger batteries and there are So many product that are happening for Now back to 2009 where there were no car So what's interesting these days is EVS Grow 50% year-over-year you know there's There's a big bad publicity right now Because it's not as big of a thing than When we returned from covid but it's Still growing massively for us it's Really hard to sustain kind of the I Would say 60 to 70% growth Year-over-year but the point is for once The consumer is in the driver's seats

Because now there is enough Supply there Is enough product for the hunter that I Am or you know the the herban people to Have an EV that suits their needs and Now dealership needs to be able to sell Those product before it used to be oh Take this one full price and maybe You'll you'll have it in two years now Is that the have inventory so they need To be as creative as they they were with Internal combustion engin so we see the The market evolving where consumer will Have more power and we've seen the price Of the car the lithium the battery packs Diminishing so it's getting more and More access ible and that's what we want We want everybody to be able to access a Charger for sure but everybody to be Able to access an EVS so the price Parity is is coming faster than than What we were Expecting more from this conversation Right after a quick Break and before we start diving deeper I guess into you I wanted to ask about The logistics of setting up charging Stations in cities like New York cuz I Imagine you have to go through a lot of The Govern bureaucracy like how easy is That and like or do you decide to put a Charger like how does that work it's Really easy Doic it's it's challenging it's really Challenging and we've done one thing one

Segment that is Niche for us and we've Been very successful in Montreal Toronto Vancouver and then New York and then La It's curbside charger and they are the Most use Chargers why because people use Them overnight because they live close To the street people work in the city And they will use someone that is Driving from Philadelphia to New York Will use it over the day to have some Meeting so the point is they are so much Use it's so critical because there's Many garage orphans there's not enough Enough places to charge so it's really Challenging though you can imagine all The regulation rules from the parking From the mayor from the aesthetic from The other product the energy provider Conedison for New York for instance so There's many people so big meaning but When you start to work with the same Objective which is electrifying the curb Side it's something that starts slower But when it started accelerate and That's what I'm expecting from New York From LA from Montreal like it's Thousands of station we've been deployed In this city and it's really driving the EV ad option so yes we needs to be Patient we don't you know fulfill our Mission overnight but this is a drive Being forc that when you start to Deliver like the curbside in New York Are are used like crazy like it's one of

The best Chargers we have on our Network Because people use it all the time like Around the clock which is good and back To your last question Dominic how do you Locate Chargers one thing that I'm Really proud is we've just launched last Year an investment we going to deploy Our own Chargers so usually our business Model is we sell Chargers to for Instance a conis they buy them and we Operate them and we're getting paid for Them and when people use them we have a A little piece of the transaction Whereas as the industry mature as we Long-term company like us and we have Reliable product we want to be able to Fulfill the gap on our Network where Maybe there's no no customer does want To buy the Chargers so I want to be able To deploy our own infrastructure and Take your risk on utilization so when You take a utilization risk what do you Want you want to add your risk so with The database we've de up over time Knowing exactly how people use our Station exactly where we know where we Can put chargers for them to be more Profitable so what we do when we locate Charger with our partners for instance In Canada we're deploying 250 millions Of ultra fast charger in all provinces To be able to you know stimulate the EV Adoption but also as business interested A for-profit company we know exactly the

Place where we're going to get 15 20% of Utilization and get a return investment To convince our financial partners that We should invest more and more so it's Really about having a great networks That work feeds you with data and with Some machine learnings with so GE Localization tools you can layer Additional traffic data with the usage And the consumer data to be able to Really locate the best places to put Chargers not only for today but for the Next coming years with all the traffics All the the infrastructure that will be Rolled out in the next 10 years that It's already planned to making sure that You get a return and and you satisfy Your customer at the end of the day wait There was one thing that you brought up That I kind of wanted to go back on you Said it really quickly when you said Like the Aesthetics are you saying like Some neighborhoods don't want the Chargers in the neighborhood or like You're talking about how the Chargers Look in the neighborhood I'm trying to Figure out cuz the New York Neighborhoods can be really really picky On the Aesthetics of the block so I just Want no they're not the point is we we All have opinions right and the thing is What we love when we travel is every City is different has a different flavor And for instance in New York what we've

Done is we have our chargers but we Adapted the design of the pedestal to New York requirement in some part it's Safety requirement but the design let's Talk about it one second you have the Link pedestal in New York the gray the The square link station where you have a Screen so for instance this the benches The garbage bin all of that has a sign The lamp post as a signature so when we Bring Chargers of course there's Requirements so you want something that Fits together so we we adapted the pole Where we have a retractable cable to Look like New York and if you look at Our station they really look New York And they're they are amazing by the way Like it's a really great product but as You design a Chargers there safety Requirement like hazards this is why you Have a big pole and you never have a Cable that you can trip on the ground And on the other side side if someone Ran into a Chargers in New York we have Tested with car crash like they do in in Certification that the pole will not Injure the people in front will get like That will just bend over the car with Safety on the electricity it will be a Safety uh protection there so there are So many details that when you you want To do business with New York you have to Be patient for sure but when you do it Right as we did you have the great

Utilization then the city now is ready To Electrify big time and make an even Bigger impact on the electrification of New York five b RS and just one more Question on the actual Chargers or Installing them themselves because you Mentioned a lot a couple of minutes ago About how you guys have data so you can Tell like where people are using these Chargers or sort of like what are areas Where they'll get adopted and things Like that and so I'm curious with all of That data would you say that's like more Data that this industry would have on The people who use it than say like the Oil and gas indry like cuz I was just Trying to starting to think about it in My head like I drive a gas pared car and I'm like do they really get any Information from me when I go to these Different gas stations about say like Where they should add new state like I Don't know like and there's also of Course the safety and the security piece You have when you do have all this data On people in that way and so I'm curious You could just talk about it like what Is it like having all this data and like How is that helpful for the industry but Also like how do you guys have to like Manage it I'm just hearing my general Conso telling me that we have privacy we Have cyber security and we comply to Everything to suck to and others other B

On and whistle but yes let figure we Comply to everything because it's really Strict and we have to invest there but You're right you know anev is a computer Un wield first so there's a lot more Computing power in these cars and in the Charger all charger are connected Because we want to be in constant making Sure the charger work there's new car Coming to Market that don't comply with The standards sometimes so we need to do An overthe software update our mobile App we have release every month to bring The experience forward because there's a New payment method because now we are Roaming for instance flow will roam with A charge point which is a competitor Based in California but they allow their Users to use the flow Network and flow Allow flow networ so we're competitor But we want to bring the industry Forward and we do that with with shell Recharge and with with other charging Network so there's so much software Integration and yes that data but the Great thing about data when you comply With all the rules it just help us to Develop better product to install the Charger where EV drivers one and you Really understand the Journey of using a Chargers to make the experience better Definitely Switching gears a little bit To you and running this company and sort Of how you've built it what has it been

Like for you personally building this Company cuz like you had this idea and You started originally wanting to build An electric vehicle and then have since Since moved into electric Chargers which You've been there for a while but like What has it been like actually building The company up for you personally thanks For asking it's been an amazing journey I always wanted to be an entrepreneur First work for myself do crazy thing Change the world that's really what I Wanted to do so I'm proud and every day I wake up and I'm energized because it's Always new challenges on the other side What's as much important to me it's not Only what I call the direction the why Like fighting climate change bringing EV In the road offering the best charging Experience are y but it's also the ow That's really important to me I'm really Proud of Becca and Dominic and when I Say how I'm not saying how do you do it I'm saying how we behave so the culture At flow something that I'm really proud And we start to have a big brand in North America is we have a great culture Culture of performance but a great Culture because we collaborate we care I Call it sustainable performance we want To deliver a lot but you know we want to Live as well what I mean by that is for 100 years maybe we had an impact on our Planet the way we've developed our

Industry after the second world war the Cold War and everything so we didn't Care as much and we had a big impact on Our planet but we didn't care as much About our people and the way we we Develop our you know our social the way At work so I'm really passionate about Having a company that deliver revenues That deliver profitability that grows That can be a worldwide player but also How can we make an environment where It's fun to work we perform together we Care for each other and we really in Good and bad times are able to care About our people as much as in good Times so that's what we have at flow That is a big part of what I want to my Company and my biggest proud is after 15 Years 600 employees the culture is there I get hit by a bus tomorrow I hope it Will be an Eevee bus this culture is Going to continue and the mission's Going to continue to my biggest proud But I really feel my expression is I I'm On my ex I'm exactly where I want to be Because every year it's a new challenge Every year my CEO role is it's taken to The next level and I I want that I want The growth and I'm ready for the growth You know growing up did you always want To be like an entrepreneur yeah yeah I Was born an entrepreneur at 8 years old I told myself I would work for myself at 11 years old I start my business and

Snowboard clothing I failed I learned a Lot I I learned something if you want to Start something surround yourself with Passionate people but if you want to do Something great surround yourself with Passionate people that are ready to pay The price to deliver because it's really Hard changing the world is really hard And it's part of the culture at flow We're not only there to have fun yes we Want have fun but we're there to perform And pay the price to change the world so Definitely for for my youth I always Wanted to be an entrepreneur wanted to Change thing I hate it when people say Lou it's always been like that it will Always be oh if you wanted to to Activate my passion that was the the Sentence to mention so yes and it's why I was looking before I had the idea of Flow before I had the idea of EVS I Really wanted to find uh to find Something to change the world and so Wise for an 11-year-old to kind of come To these conclusions how did that Snowboarding company go oh I think now Ski is more uh it's definitely I would Say more important or bigger than than Snowboard but when I was young wasn't That big of a trend or something but It's something that I started to do so Young crazy full Louie wants his Business and see an opportunity where Something start trendy you know big

Brands but I wanted to do something more Affordable something that people you Know would would be able to to access More than other Big Brand and I started Something and and again an entrepreneur Is a desire to do something whatever is The idea it's an that's an idea you want To do something and I I materialized That with snowboard clothing at the Beginning because it was one of my first Passion Sports snowboard and I tried to Turn that into a business which wasn't The best uh the best Journey but a lot Of learnings and as an entrepreneur is Really important to learn from your Bests what advice would you give Founders that are looking to really Build a workplace culture that is Passionate that motivates people that Really is also you know healthy and all These things but what advice would you Give Founders because I don't know a lot Of times we talk to Founders about their Work culture and their workplace and I Don't know how much thought they give it As they're building the company it's Like they've never thought about it They're just like work culture what so What advice would you have for Founders In terms of balancing growing a company And making sure your employees actually Want to stay working for you yeah I can Give you a couple thoughts yesterday I Was doing a conference two hours

Discussion with 50 60 entrepreneurs that Are graduating from a laal university Where where I studied and they always Ask the question it's it's the best Question and the only thing that I can Do but I can explode a bit on it is go If you really want to do it go But don't be too crazy about it like try To understand the needs you're trying to Solve sometime the problem of an Entrepreneur is they have so many ideas You you really need to focus at some Point and maybe you know you need to Define your next Milestone but as much As you know the direction you're going If you go with great people you surround Yourself you'll learn you'll try to Avoid mistakes you'll make a ton of Mistakes the worst that can happen You'll have fun you'll learn and you'll Be ready for the next Journey so I see Too many people I want to be an Entrepreneur I think about something do It like as much as you can you can Calculate you can plan you know starting Something it need to spark at some point So that's the advice I I give to any Young entrepreneurs that is wondering For years you know should I should I get A job should I start my own business Surround yourself with great people There's more people that want to help That you you you can tap into just start It jump well that seems like a perfect

Place to wrap thank you so much Lou for Coming on the show this has been fun Thanks was [Music] Amazing that was our conversation with Louie and before we jump into the outro Of course we want to tell you what the Lie was and dear listeners the lie was That working with both the US and Canadian governments was easier than Expected while he said it was easy and Then explained after dear listeners you Were not on the call with us you could Not see that he gave us a pretty big Wink when he said it was easy which is Not surprising but I definitely thought The concept of having to kind of Navigate all these regulatory hurdles And policies which seem to be changing All the time is such an interesting Space to be in as a company that got Started before any of us were really Paying attention to this category at all What did you think about that D I know I Wanted Tim to go deeper in terms of how Severe things have shifted because I Imagine in 2009 like who was doing this Or were people doing this like I feel Like this has become like a really Really big thing like eeve is having Like she is the moment I could even Imagine what it was back in the day and Then in the '90s cuz he was talking About that's when he was like originally

Interested in it I'm like in the '90s What was this space I know and this is One of those things where I'm always Like oh that surprises me that there's Even kind of enough information to go Off of when he originally launched but Then I'm like maybe this is one of those Areas where I'm like we're so similar to Canada and then this is one of those Where like we're not like maybe people Cared about it and I mean he said it Wasn't super popular there either but Maybe it was like a least a little more Popular I mean they're always ahead of Us with stuff like this so like that Wouldn't actually be that surprising That's actually true I actually forgot About the Canadian part because it could Have been a whole thing in Canada and They could have we could have just been Behind as we usually always are so yeah This could have been a major topic of Discussion back in the day um in Canada But I mean even are everywhere now I was Just looking outside or I I Googled what The stations look like cuz I don't have A car I don't know anything about car Life so when I was just Googling what His what the EV stations even look like They just look like many bus stops I Would not even have known that that was A charging station I know like once he Started talking about working with New York and how New York had like all of

These specific guidelines it had to be To fit like the quote unquote New York Look I was like oh my God like I got to Go down won't say where I live but like There's some down the street for me and I'm like I got to go check it out out And like I've never notic I didn't pay That much attention to them because I Don't I drive a car but I don't have an EV which is funny of this whole Conversation in general because the Reason I didn't buy an EV is because I Didn't think I'd be able to charge it in The city and now of course literally Like a month after I bought the car New York was like we're adding all these Chargers and I was like well all right Like I guess this will be my only non EV But yeah now I'm like I got to spot them Because the ones on my street are really Hard to notice they're an EV other than The fact that the poles are plugged into People's cars cuz they really don't Stand out otherwise so now I'm curious How many are there and I was just Thinking I imagine people Uptown saying Do not put an ugly charging station next To my kids prep school I will literally Write the government so that's why I was Really wondering I'm like what do they Even look like cuz I could not imagine Just for lack of a better word like the Neighborhood's allowing an ugly EV Station especially not Uptown but I

Don't know could be stereotyping Uptown I wonder how I know that not revealing How I might know that but but I thought It was interesting about the industry Deciding that EVS should just have like Too standardized Chargers in a sense and I find it interesting that the industry Itself just collectively agreed on that Because I don't know like anytime there Isn't like the government or like Regulators forcing people to do anything I'm like okay so y'all just like met up One day and said let's just make life Easier I'm like that's so nice of you I Know and it is interesting to think About too because obviously companies in The same category compete with with each Other it's rare that you see these kind Of coming together situations where they Realize on their own that they probably Wouldn't survive if they didn't band Together in this way like I don't know Like maybe they would but it's a much Easier sell to someone if they are Concerned like me for example like Concerned with being able to actually Find places to charge where you live That if you're like well it doesn't Matter what car you buy you can charge It on any of these I could see it being Like the tide that lifts all boats but I Mean there are a lot of scenarios in Business that would apply to and you Don't see people collaborating so I

Definitely do think that is a really Interesting Factor here and I mean if You're a company like Flo who was like Working with both of the current Chargers and now it's like oh we're all Moving to one like great we can do that It's just so interesting to think about It's like like apple of course has to do The standard charger or move in that Direction because the EU is making it But yeah like you said it's so Interesting that they kind of just like Decided to do this on their own the EU Bullied them the EU is standing on Business they said Apple like seriously Come on I don't know why I'm like Randomly angry about that but this is Something I wanted to ask which this Might be like a ridiculous question if There aren't a lot of charging stations And you drive an EV and you get stranded In the middle of nowhere what happens to You well I guess like it's the same as Like when you're not near a gas station But what if like the only gas station Doesn't have an EV charging station are You just like there I have like always Wondered This and like my dad has a Tesla and like he really likes it and Like they live somewhere where there are A lot of chargers and they have one at Home also but even when they drive to New York they're live in the Boston area They absolutely never take that car

Pretty much which is always so Interesting and like maybe they've Taking it like once where in theory the Range would be fine but they're still Just like they don't want to push it Because it's like what do you do like What do you do if you run out of charge Do you call like triaa like what do you Say Where do they take you oh yeah I Guess I have no idea what it actually Happen or if it is maybe it is just as Easy as like if you run out of gas where It's like they either to you to a Station or like you can put gas in your Tank maybe triaa will come and give you A charge I have no idea wait you're in Boston and they say the nearest EV is in New York do they tow you or do they just Say hey you got to give it up what do They say I know cuz in some places you Definitely would be a lot closer to a Gas station but could be really far from A charger I don't know see the these are The things I think about I'm creating up Scenarios these are the things like I Think about and then it's like no Becca Based on where you live you would Literally never have that problem but I'm like but unless like this is Literally made up but you know what like Really quickly the cyber security Element which we didn't talk much about Was a really interesting point in terms Of the data they're collecting because I

Was trying to think quick enough of what A hacker would want from EV data I Couldn't think of anything immediately But I know that there are I mean what Would they do with that data yeah that's The thing cuz it's like normally when You get in these conversations about Cyber security it's like so obvious like Why you wouldn't want the data to get Out but in this case like it's Definitely less obvious and I maybe I Just again like as someone who doesn't Own an EV like maybe it's like there's a Lot of stuff in there that I'm just like Not familiar with that would be really Bad but yeah cuz I it had never occurred To me until he said that just how Because they are literally computers on Wheels which I've heard that saying Before but it never connected to me that It would be a lot easier to mine data From those cars than it would be from Regular cars which I know like you can Mine regular data from Cars I spent a Lot of time going down to Rabbit Hole to See if my car computer was sending my Driving information on Lexus NEX Lexus Nexus a few weeks ago after New York Times story but like the gas and stuff Like I don't think they could do Anything with that so it's weird we're All too much data big data everywhere It's in your gas tank or your quote Unquote your electric gas tank or

Whatever I don't know if they call it Anything B that's the real word yeah I Not that I'm saying that someone should Hack an EV and you know surprise us with What they take and report back yeah our Cyber security team will have a story Soon I'm sure yeah all we're saying is We're not encouraging anyone to do that But if you do write it up and send it to Us we would love to read it cuz I'm now Curious yeah if you don't mind prison Time and a tech crunch feature uh we Just want to know what happened Found is hosted by myself TechCrunch Senior reporter Becca scac alongside Senior reporter Dominic madori Davis Found is produced by Maggie stamitz with Editing by Kell our illustrator is Bryce Durban founds audience development in Social media is managed by Morgan little Alyssa Stringer and Natalie chman Tech Crunch's audio products are managed by Henry pikovit thanks for listening and We'll be back next week [Music]


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