Fair value for Bitcoins around 55k so I think
we drift upwards toward that that level but then The punters are gonna come and we're already
up 100 so that leaves a 5x from here when I Talk to Mark yusco back in February he told me
that at the end of the crypto bear Market was Just around the corner I was skeptical
but he was actually right I knew crypto Rally has finally kicked off with BlackRock
filing an application for a spot Bitcoin ETF yusuke thinks this is just the beginning
of a parabolic move that will bring Bitcoin To newest time highs in anticipation of the
half Wings had to take place in April 2024. In this interview I talked with Mark about
his crypto price outlook for the next months And the main catalyst we should look for I'm
Giovanni on this show we challenged the ideas That shape the world of crypto in each episode we
assess a crypto narrative a macroeconomic Outlook Or a potential disruption technology only the
most solid ideas will make it to the other side Foreign Last time we talked I think back in February um
you were saying that this year we were gonna see The start of the crypto summer so these uh renewed
Bitcoin crypto bull market what do you think has The crypto Summer started and do you think that
the application by BlackRock for uh Bitcoin for a Spot Bitcoin ETF triggered that the start of the
crypto summer well we ended crypto spring uh in June I think I think it was kind of you know last
June 15th where we had the the bottom then we had Another interim bottom after the FTX debacle and
then you know this year uh June 15th I think to Me was was the trigger now people look at it and
say oh we had this big Rally from December of last Year into into June so isn't that isn't that the
rally or not that to me that's just the beginning Kind of that that got us back to even over the
previous year and now I I you know I look at at Where we're headed in a in a crypto summer now
what is crypto summer mean well it's it's where The attention of the markets kind of shifts toward
this having event in this period between now and The having I think we drift upward towards fair
value what's fair value I will argue based on A metcalf's law model fair value for Bitcoins
around 55k so I think we drift upwards toward That that level but then the punters are going
to come right if we go from 30 to 55 everybody's Gonna say oh we're going to the Moon again people
are going to throw out the multi hundred thousand Dollar targets and we probably will have a
speculative blow off top sometime in 2024 That leads to the next downturn in the
next crypto winner so it's a long answer Okay that's interesting so you expect
the next downturn to be already next year Well 2025. so the downturn so the way I think
about it and it's just my way of thinking about It the four-year cycle tends to run June to junish
so you know we saw crypto spring June 22 to June 23 June 23 to kind of April May 24 uh will be
crypto summer then we'll get the blow off top kind Of from May of next year to to kind of May April
May of the following year and then then we start
The next downturn sometime leverage will come back
my my one thought though on that Giovanni is that The Leverage in this cycle probably
won't be as bad as the previous two Meaning there won't be as much leverage available
and therefore the highs probably won't be as high You know if you think about the two cycles
ago we went up 40-fold a big move then last Cycle we went up 20-fold this cycle
I think probably more like tenfold And we're already up 100 so that leaves a 5x
from here so could I see a price in the 150 range Yeah yeah I can see okay yeah that's pretty
realistic uh perspective on the future outlook On the Bitcoin price uh I just want to talk about
the latest uh big news of crypto which is uh the Application by BlackRock tool for a Bitcoin for
a Bitcoin ETF which apparently triggered the Beginning of this crypto summer I've said for for
a long time actually for over a year that no one Else was going to get approved for the ETF but you
know the wink of us Twins and ARCA and and and dcg All these guys were making the application
like they're going to get stamp rejected I said The only person I saw that had a shot was
was BlackRock there's a lot like well because They're part of the group I mean they're part of
the incumbents and so shockingly uh they release Their application now it coincidentally with
the beginning of what I deemed crypto summer BlackRock shows up and says hey we want
to do an ETF I think it will be approved I don't know when right but but my guess is
you know sometime in Q3 or early Q4 I think That is going to change some of the Dynamics
of this crypto bull market and the reason is Um just supply and demand right there's there's a
whole bunch of people who aren't going to sell at Any price and demand is going to rise if a bit
if a spot ETF is approved and it's to me the Antithesis of what happened in November of 21 when
they approved the Futures ETF and from that point Prices just went down well why is that if
there was a Futures ETF approved why didn't That increase the price of Bitcoin well because
Futures ETFs do the opposite they actually allow Banks and other large speculators too short the
price of the asset because you can create a paper Asset out of thin air and you've seen it in
the gold markets you've seen it in the oil Markets you've seen it in the in the Commodities
markets now we've got the onset of what could be Not just tens of billions but potentially hundreds
of billions of demand from people who trust BlackRock right there are a lot of Institutions
they just trust Larry and and BlackRock and and They will buy this asset and so I just want to
follow up on that because um I was talking not Long ago with an ETFs Analyst at Bloomberg his
name is Eric balchunas he said that yes not here Yeah she said that basically according to his
estimates this uh this spot ETF has around 51 He puts the odds at 51 getting approved 49 not
getting approved so he he is like tilting more Towards a positive outcome what is your estimate
of the odds look I I mean I love Eric but I Think he's a great guy I think he's being way
conservative BlackRock is uh applied for 576.
ETFs they've gotten 575 approved they've only
lost once I would say the odds are way higher Than 51.49 look I I think it's a done deal I I
think it's been a done deal for years they've just Been waiting for the right time um I I actually
think it's getting better but you know I never Say a hundred percent because you know things
can happen but I I'd say 51 is very conservative But it's not a bad position to take as you said
BlackRock is one of the incumbents uh there is This narrative that say that basically uh the
incumbents are trying to take over crypto they Can take over Bitcoin through this uh regulated
uh exchange traded fund and that simultaneously They are cracking down uh through the SEC on Midas
coinbase so it's all some sort of a scheme made by The incumbents to take over crypto the question
is should we welcome the filing of BlackRock for Our spot Bitcoin ETF or should we be afraid
of it well blockchain technology does is it It basically disrupts Financial Services the
way the internet disrupted media and commerce Now we have a third Ledger an immutable trustless
truth Ledger that says 100 100 everybody agrees It was a hundred there's no fraud there's no uh
malfeasance and and you don't have to trust me Anymore in fact they didn't even have to know
each other we can just transact peer-to-peer Globally instantaneously no more gold and
evolved no more money being printed it's a Pretty glorious future but the incumbents are
like whoa whoa wait a second I don't like that I like my seven trillion dollars a year my six
to eight percent of global GDP that's good for me So it's not surprising at all that The Regulators
would rig the system such that they don't approve The disruptors coming into the party to take
some of that seven trillion well now BlackRock Which is part of the group says hey we want
to take the one percent fees every year not You know dcg and the other disruptors and
now I think what happens is they say okay And so should we welcome them not really right
but should we be happy that we get a better Functioning system and ultimately we strip
some of the costs out and so we win a little Bit sure and will people look the hardcore
Maxis they'll hold their Bitcoin in Self Storage self-custody put on a ledger which
we love because we own a piece of Ledger Um and everything's out but for the average person
who has never like my dad never gonna hold his own Keys just not gonna do it he's perfectly happy
at coinbase he'd be perfectly happy to buy an ETF we need these C5 these centralized Finance
structures as a bridge to the beautiful Decentralized future so that's a long-winded
way of saying we shouldn't like celebrate them But we should welcome them and we should be happy
that more participants will now enter the digital Age thanks a lot Mark for this great conversation
as usual it's a pleasure to have you on our show And I look forward to talking to you again in
a few months and see how your predictions will Have played out that sounds great enjoy the rest
of your summer and uh we'll see you in the fall
Coinbase is a popular cryptocurrency exchange. It makes it easy to buy, sell, and exchange cryptocurrencies like Bitcoin. Coinbase also has a brokerage service that makes it easy to buy Bitcoin as easily as buying stocks through an online broker. However, Coinbase can be expensive due to the fees it charges and its poor customer service.